If you are going to go pre-emptive....

make it count, or strike to the threat is done....or else this might happen...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dQj6S0hbXYA&eurl=

DF

another interesting one...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxdCr84oK9I

Or how about this one

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HXiR5s6xWvI

i'll see you, and raise you 5...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B16f0BXiFdE

Pre-emption is something I'm struggling with, which sucks as I'm working the door to get experience

you are not exactly encouraged legally to be pre-emptive as a holder of the SIA 'badge' though mate, thats the problem.

pre-emptive striking is a valid (if often over emphasised) tool.. the difficult part is separating morality from legality as to how soon and how often you could get away with it

All those vids have been removed

thats interesting Dave.

is it because of the SIA badge that has come about? or are doorman just learning new tricks and avoiding the legal concequences more? cctv and all that

I think the sia issue as regards to legality seriously needs looking at. I have a collegue who is about to appear in court on an excessive force charge (by the police not the customer). All he did was 'pre-emptively' took down and controlled an aggressive customer. If he loses his badge he has totally lost his income as he is full time.

The Sia training course does not teach any control/restraint techniques and is very non committal when it comes to explaining the law on 'hands on' techniques. Many of the door supervisors that I know have no MA experience either, so when sh*t meets fan they must feel well out of their depth.

To me it feels as though the sia are prepared to let unprepared individuals deal with the violent side of society and handle conflict with no firm support or guidelines and no restraint tools. They also have to pay £270 quid for the priviledge. They don't answer their phones for hours on a 0845 number when chasing up their incompetance either.

They then expect you to take the rap from the Police when in a split second decision you decide to pre-emptively right cross a potential life-threatening individual.

The whole situation is totally imbalanced. The public do need protecting from thuggary but some of the individuals who make all the big decisions should step into the shoes of the door supervisors from time to time and see that they have to keep the peace with two arms tied behind their backs.

Sorry for the rant guys but thats how it feels sometimes.

Marko you are only half right about SIA not teaching C&R stuff.. there is a new legislation that now makes it compulsary for a MINIMUM of one days C&R training, this will be in next year

the SIA have appointd the ICM (Institute of Conflict Management) to formulate the course content (physical intervention course) and WE (Your Guardians Ltd) have been appointed by the ICM to devise the techniques

I agree with Marko's comment about having to keep the peace with arms tied behind backs. I nearly got suspended for dealing with a pissed up staff member at one of my venues that decided to swing for me. I waited for the 3rd punch and made sure the cctv caught it all before i reacted. I still ended up in court with the possibility of losing my license, thankfully the judge agreed i hadn't overstepped the mark and the fact i waited for the 3rd punch and manouvred myself for the whole situation to be caught by cctv saved my skin. The judge said had i not done this my license would have been revoked. Good thing i was thinking straight and read the situation first.

seems to me the SIA is a licence for the assholes to get away with hitting you, cant even defend yourself these days.

think i might give it a miss. get a job at mac d's

I stand corrected Dave, didn't know that. Did my training quite a while back. Things seem to be slowly improving then, so thats good.

Quick thinking Abnett... good for you keeping your badge.

Les, It's worth doing for the experience or if you need the extra cash. It aint all bad and I have met some really nice people through the job.

My personla opinion is there are a lot easier jobs to to for more money and less hasle...

Even though i've had more hassle from trying to sort situations out than it's worth i actually enjoy the job. The moneys not too shabby and you do get to meet some worthwhile people. It's just the small minded pissed up minority that think they're above rules, regulations and above all the law that put the dampners on it. It is worth doing for the experience, if anything it's toughened me up mentally more than physically as the majority of problems is the verbal confrontation, goading and abuse. Once you rise above that and control yourself you leave feeling a better person for it. Some situations can be proper eyeopeners though! Overall, in the right team, it's a good crack!

I do agree Peter, there are less hassle jobs around, but here in Cheltenham you get more hassle avoiding the tumbleweed.